And that’s just with Oculus Go, then you can get a different program?

It’s amazing.

I could stay doing this all day.

Was meditation something you always had to do because of your heart condition?

How does it compare to other forms of meditation you’ve tried?

How long do you usually spend in this in a day?

Let’s go ask Pluto how it feels about not being a planet anymore? Traveling to Pluto.

This is great fun.

The models, Malay. How I come back now? OK, I got you.

It’s telling me about the models.

What did I do when I pulled the trigger?

"You are here."

Why is Australia so red?

There we go. It’s night time in London.

Right.

Did you notice? I spoke louder when I had on. The people always do that.

[laughs] I never did VR before.

Yeah. Which one’s the Play button? [laughs]

Now it’s on the Menu screen I think. Star Chart it says, yeah. Shall I click on Sky View?

Now I’m on the other...

Now I think I’m on the Menu screen.

What do I calibrate?

What do you think? Is there anything else you’d like to say?

I think I’ve finished my questions. That’s 40 minutes actually as well.

Is that likely to happen anytime soon given that Facebook and WhatsApp in Google hold most of the...?

On the divisive.

Yeah. I saw this on a site, and I didn’t quite understand it.

Obviously, and this does fit into LGBTI rights in particular, but it affects a lot of people. We’ve seen a kind of populism polarizing in the US a lot and also in Europe with far right movements. We’ve just seen the election in the Brazilian far right has a lot ...

Could you tell us more about that?

I didn’t know until I started thinking about you and researching you. I didn’t know too much about this. I saw the Asia Society’s speech where these slides are from, and this open government, government zero, zero government and this being about collaborative findings in common and various things. Is ...

You feel that your approach has been adopted and...

Really?

Has there been any tension with the existing structures of power?

Possibly we could talk a bit more about that. How easy was it for you as a anarchist or revolutionary Occupier? How easy was it for you to go to the other side or to start working with the government? What was that journey and that thought process?

It’s just the live feed?

How often do you do it?

How do you do it?

Yes. Sexuality equality. That’s the two questions. The first is about, what do you think we are moving towards?

Yeah. The second one, I’m just going to ask together because I don’t want to forget, would be a way to start talking about your work a bit more as well. It seems that maybe that your journey of gender identity has informed your relationship, or you’re quite passionate for ...

I have two questions The first is whether you think we are heading towards that more Judith Butler ideal deconstruction.

...became the identity that you chose, or what journey you took, and whether you think that’s similar to other people or completely different, or how it relates to being Taiwanese and Asian, of course. That would also most interesting for me.

I think I would like to know more about your personal journey. I haven’t actually spoken to that many...I don’t think I’ve spoken to anyone that’s identified as postgender. If you’d be happy to talk me through how that...

Is there anything else you’d like to say about LGBTI issues or your journey as a postgender person?

...homosexual or the like. I was surprised. For me, 137,000 people in the streets on Saturday is a big deal, but apparently, on a Sunday, it’s not really...it wasn’t on all the front pages of the local newspaper. This is similar to what we just discussed, like LGBTI issues are ...

What would you say, on a larger level, the debate over marriage equality? I think I’m seeing it from a biased...not biased but from one point of view, because a lot of my friends are...

...things?

What have you seen? Do you connect with other approach, gender diverse movements in Asia? What positive things do you see in...

It seems to me I haven’t been covering these issues for a long time, but I’ve been covering them recently. It seems to be quite quickly moving, and it’s quite polarizing in the US. It’s been picked up by a lot of different people.

Or gender diverse rights?

Would you mind talking a bit about transgender rights?