Take care. Cheers. Bye.

Audrey, thank you so, so much. Best of luck, and stay safe.

Actually, you know what? That would be great. I have to turn this in in about a week, but then there’ll be two or three weeks of editing, so there would be time to incorporate that. I’ll make a note to follow up with you, but also, if you remember, ...

I’ll be back in touch if I have other questions. In the meantime, again, I really appreciate this. Congratulations on all of your successes there.

Unbelievable. Well, this is all really wonderful for now. I’ll look at those links that you’ve sent. I really appreciate it, Audrey. Thank you so, so much for your time, especially right now.

I don’t know if you saw the news from last night here, but apparently, our president thinks that you should be drinking or injecting yourself with bleach and other cleaning products.

Have there been worries about disinformation or misinformation campaigns?

Are there other basic important elements of this constitution of social trust that you think get lost, get missing, or aren’t paid sufficient enough attention to?

In the few minutes we have left, because I don’t want to take up more of your time…

Hopefully, we can return to it when this is all over.

This is not a cryptographic problem. This is a public health problem.

Did you guys look into anything like the Bluetooth stuff? I asked about this, just because it’s become such a big topic of conversation here, and so much energy has been put into it. One of the things that I really appreciated about this guy in Singapore, the product lead ...

Oh, a funny meme?

Pushes out what in an hour?

I can say that. I can say that.

What are the other basic mechanical, preventive measures that were taken in addition to ramping up masks early that, again, are just simple, basic failures of competence elsewhere in the world?

Were there people then saying that this was too early to be making administrative decisions like that, or did people think, “Oh, that’s very prudent of them to be invoking these kinds of production powers now”?

Then you were going to mention something else about SARS before I asked you to explain.

It’s fine. I can also look it up. You were saying that memory is so strong with people that that was part of…

Wait, but before you go on, explain. How long was the hospital barricaded for?

A barricade of the entire, what happened?

Oh, with SARS?

Did you have to pass a law to use that telco data, or was there already a…

I’m curious about other things that might look from the outside to be automated, but are in fact, or do in fact, represent social…

I’m curious if there are other examples where, because it seems to me the view from here, as I mentioned, is that a much greater emphasis on things that resemble automation that then, that there’s always some mechanical trick behind it, or there’s always some human labor behind it.

Oh.

Are there random calls, then, to make sure that people aren’t leaving their phones home?

Then it’s just, if the phone leaves the geofenced area, there’s an automatic notification to the police, and then they call?

Has Taiwan used digital ankle bracelets in the way, for example, Hong Kong has with…

Do you have to pay for that yourself, or does the healthcare pay for that?

It was used in the case of that cab driver and the businessman from Wuhan?

What…

I had read that the case with the cab driver was basically the only time that they had used the merged databases of the immigration…

In this case, what was being verified here when individuals were sharing reports at symptoms? What there was being verified?

Percent, you mean?

Right, which was a very cute…

It seems to me that verified and collated is a pretty big step that they just jump over. I’m curious about what that verified and collated means.

Glen and Jaron write, “Individuals use the platform to show reports voluntarily in real time about symptoms using a variety of media, such as a call on Line and smartphones. This information was quickly verified and collated.”

I felt like it was unexplained here, and I wanted a little bit more background, which was when…Now, I’m trying to find it. Oh, in the stuff about the maps that were available for distribution after the Diamond Princess docked.

That’s a good point. I have a question about this article that Glen Weyl and Jaron Lanier had written for Foreign Affairs. This might seem like a fairly specific question, but I think it does get to…

I’m just getting that down. What does that social shaming look like? That’s just people on the street saying to you, “Why don’t you take good care of yourself?”

It was more that, I suppose the free rider problem here was about other people not complying with things like wearing a face mask or panic buying, for example.

That part of voluntary compliance is being able to proceed with the expectation that there won’t be free ridership elsewhere.

Do people worry about, because it seems…One of the other things is in the political science literature about how one develops a relatively high degree of social trust a voluntary compliance with things is that people are confident that free riders will be punished.

It just seems to me, one of the things I’d like to hear you expand upon a little bit is that, even in just now, when you talked about this relatively high degree of social trust, that other people are being compliant, is not some magical property of the Taiwanese ...

That it thus, that it’s not something that then could be cultivated or that could come out of institutional relationships. Instead, it’s just, “You either have it or you don’t.” Unfortunately, we in America are a low-trust society.

Which is to say that that’s not something that explains the success, it is something that has to actually be explained. Whereas so often this attitude toward social trust is that it’s either something that magically exists in a society, or it’s something that doesn’t.

What I think is interesting about what you just said, I think that there’s, when people write about such things as a high degree of social trust or a high degree of social cohesion, to me often, it’s treated as that’s the explanan, so to speak, when it should be ...

I wonder about the element of coordination on the other side of it.

I think, especially in some of the conversations about the technology here, there’s an overemphasis on what can be done via a purely distributed system. I’m curious about how you see the relationship of the centralized, coordinated efforts with the decentralized?